Comment by iolene Alleyne on September 11, 2009 at 9:42am

There is no mention in the Bible of a Pre tribulation rapture.

Matthew 24:27
For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man.
Revelation 11:19
Then God's temple in heaven was opened, and within his temple was seen the ark of his covenant. And there came flashes of lightning, rumblings, peals of thunder, an earthquake and a great hailstorm.
1 Thessalonians 4:16, 17
“For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God; and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.”


http://bibleprobe.com/rapture.htm.htm

Comment by iolene Alleyne on September 12, 2009 at 8:01pm

Mark of the beast parallel

We see a similar situations in the old testament When God marked his people for protection.
Ezekiel 9:4 And the Lord said unto him, “Go throughout the city through the midst of Jerusalem and put a mark on the foreheads of those who grieve and lament over all the detestable things that are done in it"--- Those without the mark were slain. (This was in a Ezekiel’s vision)
Here the people were "marked" for protection.

Going back to the Passover in (Exodus 12:21-23). Israel was "marked" by blood smeared on the doorpost. On the eve of the Exodus, the death angel swept through Egypt, killing the firstborn. He passed over any door marked with blood.
Here they were also “marked” for protection. This was literal, but the markings were done by the occupants of each households as God had commanded.

End time

It is hard to envision so many millions of people throughout the world being literally marked in the forehead and the right hand with the number 666. However it is not impossible. Who in the mid 1900s would have envisioned the cell phone?

Comment by iolene Alleyne on September 13, 2009 at 3:58am

God Will Battle Jerusalem’s Foes

1 Behold, a day is coming for the LORD when the spoil taken from you will be divided among you. 2 For I will gather all the nations against Jerusalem to battle, and the city will be captured, the houses plundered, the women ravished and half of the city exiled, but the rest of the people will not be cut off from the city. 3 Then the LORD will go forth and fight against those nations, as when He fights on a day of battle. 4 In that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, which is in front of Jerusalem on the east; and the Mount of Olives will be split in its middle from east to west by a very large valley, so that half of the mountain will move toward the north and the other half toward the south. 5 You will flee by the valley of My mountains, for the valley of the mountains will reach to Azel; yes, you will flee just as you fled before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Then the LORD, my God, will come, and all the holy ones with Him!
6 In that day there will be no light; the luminaries will dwindle. 7 For it will be a unique day which is known to the LORD, neither day nor night, but it will come about that at evening time there will be light.
8 And in that day living waters will flow out of Jerusalem, half of them toward the eastern sea and the other half toward the western sea; it will be in summer as well as in winter.

God Will Be King over All

At the time of tribulation Gods people are instructed to flee to the mountains. I think that some survival skills will be necessary. Any thoughts on this?

Comment by iolene Alleyne on September 13, 2009 at 4:59am

Shalom Labrock,

I would like for you to comment on this.

Flee to the mountains.

Luke 21: 20-23 'But when ye see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that our desolation is at hand. Then let them that are in Judea flee unto the mountains; and let them that are in the midst of her depart out; and let not them that are in the country enter therein. For these are days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.' And further, "'Woe unto them that are with child and to them that give suck in those days! And pray ye that your flight may be not in the winter, neither on a Sabbath: for then shall be great tribulation, such as had not been from the beginning of the world until now, no, nor ever shall be.'

Jesus was addressing the people in the land of Israel which is very mountainous. The same would apply to believers in other parts of the world. "Find a mountain to flee to!! But there are some places that do not have mountains. eg small islands such as Aruba. Where will they go?
One school of thought is that all Gods people will be dwelling in the land of Israel by then. I dont think so.

Comment by William H. on September 14, 2009 at 3:03pm

Leading up to that area we are given the seals Luke 21:8-, that are to be compared to Matt. 24, Mark 13 Rev 6 and 8.

Armagedon = gathering place. (some only point to the valley of Megedo just a stones throw away,but that is missing the point). We are speaking of that which leads up to the 2nd Advent of Christ and the anti shall come before the true Christ. This is the great Apostacy that shall decieve those of the World. We are told what the famine is of vs.11- Amos 8:11/
***2 Thessalonians 2:3
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition
Matthew 24:15-26 (King James Version)

15When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)

16Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:

17Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:

18Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.

19And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!

20But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:

21For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

22And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

23Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.

24For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

25Behold, I have told you before.

26Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.

This "holy place" IS Jerusalem (The Holy Mount.) The gathering place. Those who are impregnated are those who bare the mark of the beast. The Impregantion represents the forhead which represents Spirit, they embrace the ideologies and deseption of the Enemy. to give suck is to nurse such along with works which represents the hand. They are decieved and doing the works of the enemy. Far from a relationship with Christ and haveing the seal of God.
The calling here is to seperate yourself from such. Just as in Exodus of Egypt the people were told to flee quick. It shows where ones priorities are.
We are later told that we will be delivered up to this one reguardless and at that time we have a job to do! Note loved ones will deliver loved ones to this wicked one for they will be decieved and embrace this wicked one as Christ.
Too many people are seeking peace in the Holy Land and will note sound the trumpet when the fake peace comes but will embrace it instead.
Christ's Kingdom is Not of this World. All will be in Spirit form when Jerusalem is the captial of the Kingdom.

Comment by Rick Kelly on September 16, 2009 at 10:27pm

Hi Labrock,
I use to teach the Rapture 'Theory' years ago, but with further reading of the scriptures I found I was in TOTAL error. I was taught about the rapture when I was a babe in CHRIST.(1973). It sounded great then, what a wonderful GOD, who takes his people out of harms way. But the more I studied, the more I realized it just wasn't true.
It is not logical for the Lord to teach us to put on the whole armour of GOD so that we can stand. Eph. 6:13. And then take us out of the way.
Also GOD is against those that say your soul will fly away with JESUS. Ezek. 13:20.
Again it says we will be changed after the last trump. 1Cor. 15:51&52. It would be very difficult to have the last trump before the tribulation.
Of course there are many more scriptures to prove the Rapture in error.

In the service of JESUS
.Rick.

Comment by William H. on September 17, 2009 at 3:00am

Thanks Rick and glad that you joined the group,May God use you as an instrument to open others eyes to the truth on this vital subject in this generation:) I agree and Amen/ I'm glad we have an area where we can get around to covering the subject throught the Word in discussion and study with others.

Comment by William H. on September 22, 2009 at 12:00am

Mark 13:20 ;)

Comment by William H. on July 12, 2010 at 10:45am

Rev.6:8 One Fourth of population killed

And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

Rev.9:15 One Third parth of mankind SLAYED

And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for to slay the third part of men.

One Forth of 100 = 25 leaving 75
75 minus one third equals 50
Altogether you can say up to one hafe of the World's population is killed in these two verses

Comment by His_Will on November 22, 2010 at 12:39pm

Lk.22:31-36 ________ Satan desired to decieve Simon yet Christ desired that Peter would stand in trails and tribulations(against the devil) that he would be found grounded on The ROCK (not to fly away) and to go forth and strengthen the brethern. Peter desired to take up his cross unto death not to escape tribulation or "rapture away" but rather to stand bold as Jesus his model had been known to do. Christ responded by telling Peter he still had much growth to embrace. vs.35-36 speaks about how Peter knew not real tribulation while Christ was with him, but that when he is sent forth that first he shall acquire a Sword (The Sword of truth). ("it is finished" - Christ the WORD is that sword) / Some like to point to Lk.21:34-36 out of context on the subject of "Rapture". Ask them to compare it to Jn.17:14-19 (Lk.12:5)/ The elect are sealed and dont fit the discription of those in vs. 34. Those who are sealed escape that which comes on all cause they are armed to do so.

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