(To discuss this blog and or subject join the group "The Tribulation Key", or start a discussion thread!)  

Where do ALL scriptures agree on the subject of our Gathering back to Christ? (Documentation is the focuss)/ Lets take a look at all the main areas people highlight when discussing the harvest.

No one will miss the 2nd Advent (Harvest). No where in scripture can one document such a thing! You Can document that All will be changed at the 7th trumpet. You can document some will be gathered "taken" and some forsaken "left" (look at the Greek over English Matt 24). You can document that the anti-christ comes (1st/next) before the return of the True Christ .The Anti will come (with) in (a false) Peace(Apostacy- same message as "pre trib rapture"). Christ comes Not to send Peace /but rather a sword (sword of truth/judgement). Christ comes without Observation. The anti comes With Observation. Ones Spirit does Not go into the ground at Physical death. All will shed the flesh at the 7th trumpet (The antichrist shall come while man is yet flesh) God is against those who teach people to fly to save their souls (Eze.13:20)! The two candlesticks and olivetrees (witnesses) will be here during the tribulation (of the antichrist). The way we overcome the tribulation is by the Seal of God where others have the mark of the beast. Those with the Seal of God will have a job to do during the tribulation.

Those void of the seal of God bare the Mark of the beast and will embrace the anti, the substance they seek shall come in the form of the apostacy (deception of false peace/falling away). This is why family members will deliver family members unto death -The devil (Heb.2:14)- they believe the antichrist is Christ come to rapture them out of here for they arent aware the kingdom (king and his domain) are within his people. This is why some will be impregnated by the lies, and giving suck (nurseing along the deception through their fruits- false teachings and (evil) works of the enemy (Lk.21:23)).

There is a first and second resurrection and a first and second death. We can't force spiritual maturity on another out of concern. At the beginning of the Lord's day all will shed the flesh (7th trumpet) in an instant. (First death) All will be in the spirit realm. The First fruits will take part in the first resurrection, those who dont take part in the first resuurection (at the beginning of the Lord's day) will either take part in the second death or the second resurrection (at the end of the Lord's day). The final judgement takes place at the End of the Lord's day (Great White throne of Judgement) not before the Lord's Day, The tares and wheat grow together but notice which is harvested First (out of season!). The Lord's day is a time of discipline for those who dont take part in the first resurrection. ALL THIS IS BIBLICAL 

(When i personally look at all the scriptures in harmony on the subject I don't feel there can be any support for the "Pre. Trib. Rapture". Actually I see G-d speaking against it often and expressing that The Antichrist will come with such a doctrine.) 

(The saviour says if you dont take up your cross and follow him you are not worthy of him. Just uttering a name doesn't give one victory (Matt.7:21-23), its all about your personal Relationship and walk with The LORD. Thinking your gonna fly away when the tough gets going is wishful thinking and ignores scripture and the trials of God's people throughout scripture.)


DOCUMENTATION: God's people have a purpose during the tribulation.  A separation (of the wicked and justified/wheat and tares/ sheep goats) takes place at the beginning of the Lord's day (and relative to the grave as well)/ 7th trumpet/ Coming of Messiah.  *(Gen.18:23-25/ Deut.1:16-17;32:4/ Ps.58:11) 1 Chronicles 16:22 (Ps.105:15) left


Man consists of both a Spirit and flesh (Gen.2:7, 1 Cor.15:35-58, 2 Cor.5:7-10, Ecc.12:6-7, Jn.16:28) Hebrew term for Soul is to say a living breathing thing and the whole of the entity its different than the term for spirit which is that breath of life which is liked unto the wind. The spirit in context is a soul before it is ever placed into flesh but at that point the flesh becomes a soul (living breathing thing), thus soul sleep can speak of either the Physical (1st) death Or Spiritual (2nd) death. these points are layed out in the blog where are the dead.



At physical death the Spirit enters into the Spirit realm and the flesh returns to dust (physical grave-"hell").


-Ecc.12:6-7 / Or ever the silver cord be loosed, or the golden bowl be broken, or the pitcher be broken at the fountain, or the wheel broken at the cistern. Then shall the dust return to the earth as it was: and the spirit shall return unto God who gave it.
-2 Cor.5:7-10/ (For we walk by faith, not by sight:) We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we may be accepted of him. For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.

-Heb.9:27- And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: / No such thing as reincarnation- ceasing to exsist and then re-exsisting. (There are two types of Soul sleep /1st death/ physical death /2nd death/ spiritual death- Documented in "where are the dead" blog)

At the last trumpet all shed the flesh. 1 Cor.15:50-53. You wont have need of the corruptible flesh ever again.

All souls are God's to do with whatsoever he will (Ez.18:4)

After the tribulation All will see Christ coming. Matt.24:29-31


We get a discription of The Spirit Realm in 

The Parable of the rich man and Lazarus 

Lk.16:19-31 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day: And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores, And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame. But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented. And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence. Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house: For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent. And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

While there is no temptation of the flesh in the spirit realm the truth is tourment to those who are not in good standing and they are seperated from those in good standing and both sides are alert spiritually. You will find that pre trib followers disreguard many scriptures yet the truth finds where they all agree! (We dont even have to mention Margret McDonald ;) > 

Gathering Back <p>Many pre trib followers pervert the following passage and Always seem to quote starting After the subject. 1 Thess. 4 is directly addressed to the church and its focuss is around the Hope we have in Yeshua as believers. (Matt.24:31)

1 Thess.4:13-18- 13 But I would not have you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning them which are asleep (*THE SUBJECT- sleep is to say physically dead), that ye sorrow not, even as others which have no hope /Lk.24:5/. For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him (*Resurrection*). For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. /(prevent-Strong's # 5348- to be beforehand, precede-We cant precede them for they have already passed over into the spiritual realm!) For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: /

(7th trumpet- 1 Cor.15:50,51,52,53/ Rev.19:18/ (2 Cor.5:8/Ecc.12:6-7)/ Heb.9:27/ (Rom.5:12)/ 1Thess.4:17 Matt.24:31/ (Zech.14:12) 2 Pet.3:10)

 ALL are changed at the coming of Messiah/ not some)/1st resurrection/(beginning of the Lord's day) Those with a relationship with the lamb take part in the first resurrection at that time!/ Those who are in good standing in the spirit realm (right side of the gulf)..... Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up (G#726) together with them in the clouds("Clouds" used to say Large groups/Heb.12:1 (Acts 1:9)/ The Greek #3509 "nephos" in the lexicon- "a cloud, a large dense multitude, a throng"/), to meet the Lord in the air (#109 Greek / Rev.9:2/ Rev.16:17/ lit.from root "aemi"- to breathe unconsciously, that is, respire; by analogy to blow); "air" (as naturally circumambient) Aer-air-figurative-natural breath which is liked unto the SPIRIT-neshama/Ruach, pneuma (*Jn.3:8/ Gen.2:7/..) super-naturally drawn together in Spirit) and so shall we (those who take part in the 1st resurrection) ever be with the Lord (1 cor.15:54-58). Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

1 Thess 5:1-6 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child (Matt.24:19); and they shall not escape (Jn.17:15 details of this verse to follow). But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.

-Again you see mention of the Spirit gathering back to YHVH (spirit realm) at physical death and at the 7th trumpet. *After this Epistle (1 Thess.), Paul seemed to show concern that some would (had begun to) misunderstand the context of that first letter in his second (2 Thess.). Thus he follows it up with Much detail!


* 2 Thess.2 *- Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand. Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition; / "falling away"- apostasia(Lucifer is the One already condemned to perish by name . One of his names is death Heb.2:14, Apollyon is another One of his names- Rev.9:11- The root of apollyon is Apoleia which means to Perish! (#684/#662 strongs) which is the very word translated perdition in this verse./ Eze.28:18 condemned/ Jn.17:12/ Rev.20:10/ The fallen angels have also been condemned but not by individual names like the devil. Note the Devil has many names and titles and each describe different offices and roles./
Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God -( Is.14:13 / Remember Anti in the Greek means instead of (Christ) We shall document the anti will stand on the holy mount with observation and a message of peace and those of the world will embrace him.) 5 Remember ye not, that, when I was yet with you, I told you these things? And now ye know what withholdeth that he might be revealed in his time. (revealed to the brethren/ as if they were not gonna fly away and have no need of reading and understanding God's Word!) 7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way. (We have a transtive verb here in vs.7 which means you can't understand who he is unless you go back to vs.3-5 where we are told who He is, the subject is Satan standing in the holy place claiming to be God,  /"LETTETH" -G #2722- katecho- possess, to hold down. Who is holding Satan? Rev.12-  Micheal and his angels/ Michael is one of two ark angels the other Is lucifer which were to guard the mercy seat/-Eze.28:14/Rev.12:7 (Dan.10:13,21) (Dan.12:1) (Jude 1:9)). 8 And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming: (Again Christ comes afterwards! The anti comes first) Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, (dont get much clearer than that!)10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. (Be not decieved! Traditions of men make void the Word of God in ones walk/ The substance those of the world seek is coming in the form of the anti, in him they will find toerance, false peace, the ability to buy sell trade, and have health care,...Notice Satan tried to tempt Christ with earthly kingdoms and the enemy uses earthly concepts to decieve today.) 11 And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie: (Apostacy- false peace/ Those who deliver their family members unto death (the Devil) do so out of lack of knowledge - they think he is Christ come to rapture them out) 12 That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness. (Worldly (carnal) men vs. Spiritually Grounded) 13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth: (AMEN) >

The Parable of The Wheat and the Taresshows there is no "pre. trib. rapture"

Matt.13:30- Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn. 

Believers are can do people who need not fly away to aviod the tribulation. Matt.24, Mark 13, Lk.21 all speak about us being persecuted greatly in the end days -beaten, killed, cast into prision..., And Rev.6:10-11 speaks about the end days will be a time of Great martyrs for the Word. Look at the two candelsticks and olive trees (two witnesses and churches) During the tribulation. Their job is to allow the holy Spirit to speak through them and while the anti and his spiritual army which will be among us defacto are commanded not to touch God's annointed (Seal of YHVH - Eph.4:30/ Rev.7:2-3/ Rev.9:4/ 1 Chron.16:22/ Ps.105:15/ Eph.6:10-11, ),but they do and 3 days later the return of Yeshua (Rev.11)! (Those men who bare the mark will be those persecuting us leading up to that time).

>Yeshua (Jesus) comes Not with observation.   Lk.17:20-26 / vs.20 Greek word parateresis for observation shows Unpatient watching always used in a dark sense. (Used in Acts 9:24, Lk.6:7, Lk.14:1, Lk.20:20, Mk.3:2, Gal.4:10) Matt. 24:36-39, Lk.21:19, Matt.10:28, Lk.12:4-5) The proper outline is that the anti comes with this observation. When would the people not be watching or exspecting Christ? When they already embrace One as Christ!!!!!!! Those of The Word will be confident that the anti Is Christ. He (The desolator/antichrist) comes with Peace, Answers, strength, power,..... Many today want an easy way out and I often hear I can't wait, while the masses are lost and a small minority are recieveing the good news and while the elect are being grafted back together. (note:Amos.5:18/ Matt.25:1-13/Is.5:18-24/ Joel 2:1-3)

Who comes with observation? (antichrist)- Lk.17:20 And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you. And he said unto the disciples, The days will come, when ye shall desire to see one of the days of the Son of man, and ye shall not see it. And they shall say to you, See here; or, see there: go not after them, nor follow them. For as the lightning, that lighteneth out of the one part under heaven, shineth unto the other part under heaven; so shall also the Son of man be in his day. But first must he suffer many things, and be rejected of this generation. And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. (Rev.22:7) (Noah was perpared for the tribulation and was among few who made it through it, By the Grace of God/ God isnt mad at his people. His people dont make earthly concerns their priority. Matt.10:28)

Who comes with message of peace? (antichrist)-  

Matt.10:34 Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. (sword of truth/ Jesus speaking/ justice- The Word/ Harvest/ judge) 2 Cor.11:14 Lucifer comes disguised ("transformed")as a messenger of light (peace,truth/* Comes in peacfully and Prosperously - Dan.8:23-25;11:21,22,23,24,25,32), standing in the holy place- Jerusalem /Defiled Temple(Mk.13:14, Matt.24:15,2 Thess. 2:4, Dan.9:25-27)Positive or Negative/ State of Israel being reinstated was fulfilment of prophacy and will play a major role in end times. The captial of The Apostacy prior to the true messiah setting up the eturnal kingdom.All those who embrace a pre trib rapture doctrine will flock to the anti and fall away. Rabinical Jews that seek a new physical temple will embrace the anti as Messiah. non believers will embrace the anti for his great signs, wonders, and authority. Only the Sealed of God will see him as an ABOMINATION. <p>The "temple Institute" has a crown awaiting the new temple in which they can be heard saying that the high priest that wears it will represent God: http://youtu.be/JSKHV4-tA8w @ time 5:12-5:25 This is the role of the anti. Anti decieves all those OF the world: Rev.13:3,4,8

One who is sealed understands **Matt.24*******(*Lk21,and *Mk.13). Lets look at a few highlights! *Matt.24 vs.9 -Then shall they deliver you up to be afflicted, and shall kill you: and ye shall be hated of all nations for my name's sake.
vs.11)-And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many. (I hear them, they say any minute lol)
vs.15)When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)/ Armagedon/ Mark 13(:14,17), Dan. 9(:25-27) we see that the gathering place will be Jerusalem. Megiddo means "the gathering place of the crowd"/ "MO'ED" (or MOGAD) means assembly or gathering, the "holy place" in the above verse is Jerusalum (Zion)! Nothing points at the nearby vally of Megiddo as this gathering place though I dont doubt it will see some of the traffic and perhaps some action in the battle of Gog and Magog. The above verse shows who is doing the gathering out of season! Christ comes from the east (mount of Olives) moving towards the Holy Place (the antichrist and his gathering) The nearest vally is the valley of blood. (Dan.9:27- He shall take away communion (the sacrifice/ Passover sedar / Sabbath) for he will claim to be Christ with us. It will be all about your relationship with him and anyone who isnt already in a individual relationship with Yeshua will fail to see how rediculous he is, We dont find him to be tempting but rather an abomination)
vs.19-26 -And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days! (impregnated with the lies and deceptions, ideologies/ and nursing along evil works -false teaching, persecuting God's people, replaceing good with tolerance and apostacy...Mk.13:17/ Those with the mark of the beast. 20 But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:
(harvested out of season/ sabbath - rest- while sleeping ( Mk.13:26)-decieved/ flight- pheugo - run away, escape, flee/ Note, that evil one will seek to change the times: Dan.7:25/ 21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened. (This is very important and further shows that the elect are here during the tribulation which is shortened* the math is a Blog of its own.) 23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not. (Anti Christ before 2nd Advent) For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect. (if it were possible, are you feeding your spirit with truth?) 25 Behold, I have told you before. Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. (Matt.24:30-31 Yeshua comes after the tribulation of the anti) (Matt.24:42,45-46 The faithful servant will be found watching in due season, those of the world wont cause they will be embracing another as the Christ)

Matt.24:39 (in the days of Noah it was the wicked that "knew not until the flood came, and took them away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be."

> *Armed For Trib*

Ecc.1:18 <p>Jn.17:14-19 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil. (1 Thess.5:2-4) (Spiritual death/ Apostacy) They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world. Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth. //To be sealed with the truth is to escape the deception (great tribulation)// As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world. And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.( Lk.12:5) *Lk.17:28-30/  Lk.17:33-36/

Matt.24:39-44, rightly divide the Word , Feel free to join discussion HERE (who is taken, left?)

Dan.12:1-2 And at that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered (H4422), every one that shall be found written in the book./....2  And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt. (*Dan.12:11/ Dan.9:27)

Revelation of Daniel: Dan12:1 (1st fruits/1st resurrection/ ends with beginning of the Lord's day) Rev.20:4-6 <p>Dan.12:2 (2nd resurrection/death/ends with the end of the Lord's day) Rev.20:12-15 Note we see mention of the first fruits and latter harvest (1st and 2nd resuurection) >"Delivered" (Dan.12:1)-(compare to Rev.20:4-6) 1st resurrection (beginning of Lord's day) (Dan.12:2)- final (great white throne) judgement,(compare to Rev.20:12-15) at the end of the Lord's day.

The Elect have a job to do during the tribulation of the antichrist and its Not to fly away. <p>Lk.12:11-12/ Mk.13:11/ Matt.10:19-20/ Lk.21:13-19/*** Lk.17:20-21/ Lk.17:29-31/ Joel 2:28/ Lk.17:33/ Rev. 22:12/ Rev.11:18/ Rom.10:6-10 (Deut. 30:11-14)

YHVH has a plan for the elect during the tribulation and those who would have you believe you are gonna fly away before this obviously are not sent forth of God with such doctrine. If we were to fly away Why would Christ tell us to watch and that he will be pleased to find his people kindeling the fire?

The two witnesses (olive trees/ Moses and Elijah) will come with Harsh warnings. Lucifer and his spiritual army will use the spiritually dead to persecute the candelsticks (churches/ many membered body). Lucifer is told not to touch the two witnesses but when they are delivered before him The truth that speaks through them is to great for him to bear and he slays them. I see this as what ultimately shortened the time.


1st and 2nd resurrections

1st death (physical) is to shed the corruptible (body) flesh (which grows old and is prone to sickness, disease, injury,age...) At physical death the spirit (incorruptible) body steps out of the flesh then one is able to see into the spirit realm and are now a part of it. (to put on incorruption). The incorruptible body is still able to die -mortal (2nd death) untill (unless) one takes part in one of the two resurrections. When one takes part in a resurrection through the sacrifice (God's Mercy and Grace) they put on immortality. The elect (frist fruits) will take part in the 1st Resurrection at the 7th Trumpet (and those who pass over before the 7th trumpet) Those who dont take art in the 1st resuurection will spend the Lord's day on the wrong side of the gulf. (if you can see how Ez.40- to the end of Ez. speaks about the Lord's day (The temple represents the Kingdom, The priests represent the elect) you will see that is is a time of discipline for those on the wrong side and at the end of the Lord's day they will know better ((Ez43:26)). Those who dont take part in the 1st resurrection will either take part in the 2nd resurrection or 2nd death. Some will take part in the 2nd death which is spiritual and to say to perish to be blotted out. (Rev.2:11/ Rev.20:6,14/ Rev.21:8

1 Cor.15:50-58 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory? The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law. But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ. (Our Passover sacrifice) Therefore, my beloved brethren, be ye stedfast, unmoveable, always abounding in the work of the Lord, forasmuch as ye know that your labour is not in vain in the Lord. (the fly away doctrine on the other hand Is vanity) 

Yes all will shed the flesh at the 7th trumpet  1 Cor.15:50-52,  1 THess.4:17 , 2 Cor.5:8, Ecc.12:6-7, Rev.19:18, Heb.9:27, Matt.24:31, Rom.5:12

and see into the spirit realm, this is how Every Knee will bow at his coming. Blessed are those virgins who are found with oil (truth) in their lamps when he returns. LK.12:37/ (Ps.104:27/ Ps.145:15/ Matt:24:45/)Matt.16:72 Once again spirit doesnt dwell in the grave. Lk.24:5/ Jn.14:19 the flesh sleeps and returns to dust. "God is not the God of the dead, but of the living" Matt.22:32= Mk.12:27=Lk.20:38/ Thess.4:13-14

What Is "Soul Sleep"? (<--click the link)

1 Jn.2:15-17/ 1 Jn.4:2-6/ Jn.15:18-19/ Jn.17:14/ 1 Jn.3:13- Worlds enemy

Following Satan hindering Paul , he takes time out in Athens while Timotheus goes forth to comfort the believers in their faith. 1 Thess.3:3-5 That no man should be moved (shaken) by these afflictions: for yourselves know that we are appointed thereunto. For verily, when we were with you, we told you before that we should suffer tribulation; even as it came to pass, and ye know. For this cause, when I could no longer forbear, I sent to know your faith, lest by some means the tempter have tempted you, and our labour be in vain.

2 Cor.11:3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.

Lk.21:34-36 And take heed to yourselves, lest at any time your hearts be overcharged with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and cares of this life, and so that day come upon you unawares. For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth. Watch ye therefore, and pray always, that ye may be accounted worthy to *escape all these things that shall come to pass, and to stand before the Son of man. (Those sealed with truth are armed for tribulation/ Jn.17:14-19/ Lk.12:5)

NOTE: This is not the tribulation of the anti that is mentioned in prior verses (Lk.21:11-17). Lk.21:36 is speaking of the Wrath of God that comes on "all" those not in covenant with God at the 2nd advent. There is a seperation from those in god standing and those not in good standing at the 7th trumpet. All are changed (shed flesh at that time including the unrighteous. God's people are sealed and wont suffer the wrath of God 

2 Thess.1:7-8 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:


Rom.8:35-39 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword? As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter. Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us. For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

1 Cor.14:33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace, as in all churches of the saints./ Bable means confussion. Babylon is the office of confussion and sadly when people limit this to a narrow view they are not remaining very watchful. The office of confussion is working within the educational fields, economic, politics, media, entertainment, religious, ...... 

Is.26:19-21 (Tanakh- OT) 19 Thy dead men shall live, together with my dead body shall they arise. Awake and sing, ye that dwell in dust: for thy dew is as the dew of herbs, and the earth shall cast out the dead. (we have documented what takes place at physical death)20 Come, my people, enter thou into thy chambers (inner most part) ( Matt.6:6), and shut thy doors about thee (action on your part/ Physical and Spiritual Discernment): hide thyself as it were for a little moment, until the indignation be overpast. (1 Cor.10:21) 21 For, behold, the LORD cometh out of his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity: the earth also shall disclose her blood, and shall no more cover her slain. (vs.14-21 we are being told that those of earthly power and ways also will be subjected to the Almighty at death and have need of the Passover, So its best to embrace a Individual relationship with YHVH now, and keep him First.)

(1 Cor.3:16)/ Lk.12:3 Our individual relationship is bigger than being apart of society (the world). Joel 2:16-17/ There is a message here to those in whom it is revealed. It's better to wait and go for the head of the snake than to be taken out by the tail. We know that the wicked one nor the locust (scropion) army are to harm the annointed ones but until they are sealed but there will be a physical force of those with the mark who are seeking attacks against them and spirits that will seek to decieve them, calling them to gather with them, At this time a Nazerite way of life is best (Nazir/ saint) Set apart one. To not conform to the ways of the world.

Souls of the martyrs- Rev.6:10-11 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth? (Note these Spirits are alert after physical death and they are able to speak to The Lord.) vs.11 They are comforted and are told to wait for others to be martyred as well when they allow the Holy Spirit to speak through them! then The 6th seal is opened (6th vial, 6th Seal, 6th trumpet)

Jn.5:25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live. (There is a Physical and Spiritual death. And when it comes to the spirit /The incorruptible must put on immortality/ When we understand this, they know that in the spirit realm there is two contexts of being "spiritually dead".)

Jn.5:28-29 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation./ At the 2nd Advent (beginning of the Lord's day) all have shed the flesh and are in spirit and aware of where they stand. 1st resurrection (judgement at the beginning of The Lord's Day) and 2nd ressurecttion (judgement at the end of The Lord's Day) "Graves" as used above is speaking of the Spiritual state that follows physical death, and we know that at physical death the Spirit enters the spirit realm of which is divided into two parts (parable of the rich man and Lazarus).

Yet to comunicate this to man that can not see into the spirit realm you speak in terms he does know which would be "grave". All that are in the graves= (Phy.)All that have passed away. 

1 Tim. 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
Rev.16:14For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.

Job had question that today we have answered.Job was no stranger to trials and tribulations. He had friends who would proclaim to speak in God's sted and Job presented some good honest questions. Job 14:4 Who can bring a clean thing out of an unclean?
:10 But man dieth, and wasteth away: yea, man giveth up the ghost, and where is he?

Job 14:12-14 So man lieth down, and riseth not: till the heavens be no more, they shall not awake, nor be raised out of their sleep. O that thou wouldest hide me in the grave, that thou wouldest keep me secret, until thy wrath be past, that thou wouldest appoint me a set time, and remember me! If a man die, shall he live again? all the days of my appointed time will I wait, till my change come.
Here Job is exspressing his depression during his tribulations. Most of his troubles being physical, he struggled to exspress how he longed for a solution to his problems. He relates the image of a dead body resting, no longer suffering, and away from physical tribulations to his request that God deliver him from these tribulations.( again -sleep meaning physical death which is eveident to man of the flesh as being differ than the physical realization of what is going on in the physical realm/ Example: Jn.11:11-14 )

The book of Ecclesiastes is wriiten to the man that walks under the sun / fleshman (It relates to physical concepts unless other wise noted)Flesh man (Physical life) is very temporary, then you are through with it. This is the subject of Ecc.9!

Ecclesiastes 9:5-6
For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten. Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished; neither have they any more a portion for ever in any thing that is done under the sun (Man doesnt have any more a portion of things taking place under the sun in the physical realm cause physical man ceases to exsist after physical death) But again we can look to (Lk.16:19-31/ Rev.6:10/ and The two with Christ on the mount of transfiguration to show that those who have passed over are alert, Yet they are free of earthly ways and concerns. We can apply this to the Spiritually dead at the great white throne of judgement though as to say when they are blotted out its as if they never exsisted and they wont be remembered, missed or even considered again. (Refferance the blog "Eturnal Punishment")

(Is.63:16/ Is.26:14/ Ecc.8:15,17/ Ecc. 1:11/ Ps.6:5/ Ps.30:9/ Ps.31:17/ Ps.88:11/ Is. 38:18-19/ Ecc.1:1-11(vanity) / Ecc.2:16 (17 vanity)/ Ecc.8:10 (vanity)/ Ecc. 12:6-8 (vanity) /Ecc.3:9/ Ps.22:29 )
The dead (physical) body knows nothing at death cause intelect, faith and Love are all descriptions of spirit which is seperated from the flesh at death!

The devil is coming Rev.12:9/ Dan.8:25 <p>Daniel 7:25 - And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time. ( Dan. 11:36/ 1 Jn:22/ 1 Jn 4:3/ 2 Jn.1:7/ )

Matt.13:20-23 But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it; Yet hath he not root in himself, but endureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful. But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty. Which of theses soils do you believe will rejoice to see the (Post trib.) Lord's day? 


Jn.16:33 These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world.

Acts 14:22 Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that we must through much tribulation enter into the kingdom of God.

1 Thess.5:1-11/ Jn5:24-29/REv. 7:14/* Rev.20:4-6,11-15
Ez.13:18-23 God is Against those who teach his people to fly to save their souls, and to ignore God's out streched arms (His Word)! 

Jn.6:44/ God knows our hearts and is more than capable of bringing whosoever he pleases out of deception. Rev.3:10/ Eph.6:10/ Ps.49:14/ Rom.10:6-10!

Mal.3:16-18 Then they that feared the LORD spake often one to another: and the LORD hearkened, and heard it, and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the LORD, and that thought upon his name. And they shall be mine, saith the LORD of hosts, in that day (the Lord's Day) when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him. (those that take part in the 1st resurrection /embrace the Passover sacrifice) Then shall ye return, and discern between the righteous and the wicked, between him that serveth God and him that serveth him not. (In The Day of accountablity, it will be clear who served the Lord and who served mammon, there will no longer be any concept of the wicked getting ahead. Ps.58:10-11/ 1 Cor.6:2/ Instruments of God are given the gift of discernment!(Ez.44:25-) Notice: back in Mal.3:14 the term ordinance came from the Hebrew # 4931 "mishmereth" (differ than the term translated "ordinances" in vs.7) and is to mention the act of watching, a sentry, guard, soilder, one at the gate, brothers keeper, duty of preservation, safty, to keep, safeguard! One may ask why does it seem the evil always get ahead, They dont and the time will come when this is obvious, and your reward is in your perserverance. The elect have oppertunities to shed light and assistance on those in need. They shall have their reward. Notice these watchers are they that will exspose the false doctrines and will even be able to discipline the lost during the Lord's day in appropriate ways.

Notice they escape Judgement..

Another example of God people sealed during tribulation: Ex.12:13

Lk.21:19 In your patience possess ye your souls./ Lk.21:36/ Matthew 10:32-38/

WATCH Rev.13:18/ Rev.9:4 /Jn.6:66


 Harvest Playlist

suggest blogs Acts 2:34 , Where are the dead, Mark of the Beast, The two witnesses, Tradtions of men, ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oa19KgPsh1M (2nd Thess.2:7)

http://friendsnchrist.ning.com/profiles/blogs/acts-234-what-is-bein... (Acts 2:34)

Again humble discussions on this subject are open and encouraged in "The Tribulation Key Group" here at friendsnChrist. Feel free to start own discussion as well!

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Comment by His_Will on February 6, 2012 at 2:46am


Greek #5083 tereo ("keep") to guard, watch, keep (protect) just as Noah was protected During the tribulation of the flood and God saw him Through it.

Rev.3:10 Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

Jn 17:15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil (Ps.118:8)

Gods elect are sealed for the tribulation (Rev.7:1-3) 

Comment by His_Will on February 6, 2012 at 1:28am

2 Thess. 1:7-9 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power


******** Abomination of Desolation *******

The tribulation (apostacy) of The antichrist (666) come prior to the return of Yeshua HaMashiach. 2 Thess 2:1-5 

* Matt.24:15,20-24 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand:)

20But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day: harvested out of season, when one isnt paying attention or with works)

 21For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

 22And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

23Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.

 24For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

* Mk.13:14 But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains

* Dan.9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate 11:31: And arms shall stand on his part, and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice, and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate 12:11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days

4th beast (NWO)

Dan.7:24-28 24And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.  25And he shall speak great words against the most High, and shall wear out the saints of the most High, and think to change times and laws: and they shall be given into his hand until a time and times and the dividing of time. 26But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away his dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end.  27And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the most High, whose kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and all dominions shall serve and obey him. 28Hitherto is the end of the matter. As for me Daniel, my cogitations much troubled me, and my countenance changed in me: but I kept the matter in my heart

Rev.13:1-7 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy. 2And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.  3And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast. 4And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him (it)? 5And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.  6And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven. 7And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations

Rev.12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ

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